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Old 08-15-2013, 04:45 PM
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Clampy Clampy is offline
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My case that drugs should remain illegal is framed around three basic ideas:
1. Many recreational drugs do harm that goes far beyond the individual user and greatly increase the likelihood that the individual user will become an undue burden on his employer, his family, his insurers, his landlord, his creditors, other associations (school, sports, religious), and society as a whole. Making and enforcing effective laws against driving under the influence is a particular challenge.
2. Laws train the conscience of young people, and many teenagers approach adulthood with the notion that if an act is truly wrong or dangerous, then it is against the law. Once legalized, there will be many more users both because the conscience will more easily accept drug use, and because drugs are more widely available.
3. As a practical matter, substances that are legal for adults are much more easily acquired by minors. Laws against alcohol and nicotine use by minors are very rarely enforced, and I would hate for those providing marijuana to children to face no more penalty or effective enforcement than those providing cigarettes.

In a libertarian utopia where insurers, parents, sports teams, schools, employers, and other interested parties could contractually insist on drug testing, and there would remain criminal penalties for fraud or theft by deception for lying/cheating on drug tests, a society might still maintain sufficient safeguards. But legalizing recreational drugs in the current nanny state where many insurers, employers, traffic enforcement, and other parties which have interests in limiting exposure to drug users cannot fully protect their interests is a likely disaster.

I remember a high school principal once almost fired me (as a math teacher working in the school), because I overheard students in class talking about their weekend drug use, I told their parents, and I suggested their parents use widely available at home drug tests to monitor and bring correction to their children's behavior. I am confident I would have been fired had I not resigned first. 80% of the seniors at this high school were regular recreational drug users. The school resource officer, the principal, the school nurse, and most of the teachers either did not care, or had been manipulated into not acting by their desire for a paycheck. Effectively teaching math, physics, and chemistry was impossible.

Any path to drug legalization certainly needs to empower any and all associates of possible drug users (parents, schools, sports teams, employers, coaches, traffic enforcement, insurers, etc.) to implement effective drug testing programs (if they choose) as a condition of ongoing association. I would certainly want my daughter's prom date to pee in a cup before allowing my daughter to ride in his car! I would also want our military to retain the power to restrict drugs under the UCMJ.

I am curious if your view of libertarian ideals would grant all associates of possible drug users the rights to choose and limit their associations (if they wished) by insisting on drug testing as a condition of association. After all, what justification is there in limiting civil contracts not to permit drug testing under any relationship where one of the parties feels it may be necessary or desirable?[/QUOTE]

Rebuttal. ( only in regards to Cannabis)

1. Wayyyy safer than alcohol. And people should have the right to chose what the do their own body. As far as the burden on employer. How does a person smoking a dobbie on the weekend any different than getting hammered which so many almost seem to encourage. ( not that I have a issue with that do what you want as long as it doesn't harm others )
They already have laws against driving under the influence. DUID. I know 2 people that got duids for weed and they had no magic blow in this test.

2. " What about the children "
Tobacco use and alcohol use among teens had dropped significantly in the last decade through education programs and you didn't have to jail a single adult to protect a child.
It was way easier to get weed in school than booze. You had to corrupt an adult to get booze. Drug dealers don't card.

3. Snitching did no good. Drug test have spawned a whole new class of synthetic drugs that are way more harmful than their natural counterparts.

You can not repeal the law of supply and demand. From kids spinning in circles to get dizzy and light headed to the Heroin addict people want to be intoxicated.
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