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  #1  
Old 12-07-2017, 12:35 AM
fisheye fisheye is offline
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Default Baiting wildlife

This is not a troll ....I clarify because it may seem very elemental and obvious to some.

My question is, why is it ok (legal) to bait for some wildlife and not others?
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  #2  
Old 12-07-2017, 07:26 AM
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swamp snorkler swamp snorkler is offline
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Why is it okay to shoot a fish at night but not a rabbit?
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Old 12-07-2017, 08:29 AM
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If you put bait out for deer or bears, you may get one or two (maybe more with deer ) to come to the bait at a time and you probably won't pull them from very far away . When you put out bait for birds (ducks and doves ) with enough bait and time you can pull in every bird in the area. Even if you're not an outlaw and you only shoot your limit. You have baited in all the birds in an area .no one else is really going to get to shoot much. Unless you hammer on a baited field or pond every day ,as long as there's food the birds will keep coming back.
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Old 12-07-2017, 09:06 AM
Feesherman Feesherman is online now
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Because of the ease of disease spread, baiting shouldn't be ok for anything.
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  #5  
Old 12-07-2017, 09:27 AM
Smalls Smalls is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Feesherman View Post
Because of the ease of disease spread, baiting shouldn't be ok for anything.
I believe this is one reason some states have banned the practice, although I don't think you would find that explicitly stated. As far as OP's question though, I do not believe there is a logical reason to explain it across the board. Is it ethics? Is it for ecological reasons such as disease transmission and increased predation caused by the concentration of animals?

It also depends on what you consider baiting. Is a sunflower field planted for doves the same as a corn feeder on a shooting lane for deer?

I believe it comes down to--in most cases--a question of what is viewed as ethical and what isn't. Some states have banned baiting anything. Federally, you cannot bait migratory birds, but for almost anything, you can plant food plots or manipulate vegetation to increase availability of food. Deer hunters talk about honing in on particular food sources. What makes a deer feeder any worse than a white oak tree that every deer within a quarter mile is going to key in on?

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  #6  
Old 12-07-2017, 09:41 AM
Feesherman Feesherman is online now
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Originally Posted by Smalls View Post

I believe it comes down to--in most cases--a question of what is viewed as ethical and what isn't.


And whose ethics are we to use?
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  #7  
Old 12-07-2017, 10:11 AM
Smalls Smalls is offline
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Originally Posted by Feesherman View Post
And whose ethics are we to use?
The matter probably comes down to who is most vocal on the issue of baiting.

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  #8  
Old 12-07-2017, 01:06 PM
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duckman1911 duckman1911 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smalls View Post
I believe this is one reason some states have banned the practice, although I don't think you would find that explicitly stated. As far as OP's question though, I do not believe there is a logical reason to explain it across the board. Is it ethics? Is it for ecological reasons such as disease transmission and increased predation caused by the concentration of animals?

It also depends on what you consider baiting. Is a sunflower field planted for doves the same as a corn feeder on a shooting lane for deer?

I believe it comes down to--in most cases--a question of what is viewed as ethical and what isn't. Some states have banned baiting anything. Federally, you cannot bait migratory birds, but for almost anything, you can plant food plots or manipulate vegetation to increase availability of food. Deer hunters talk about honing in on particular food sources. What makes a deer feeder any worse than a white oak tree that every deer within a quarter mile is going to key in on?

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You have a good point. It is a lot of grey area regarding that. You can feed deer but not ducks,doves or turkeys. I can see why the bird hunters may get pissed about that. As you brought up what is the difference between a corn feeder and a food plot. Both are there to get deer in shooting range. Lets not forget the purpose of us being there is to kill something. It can be sugar coated for arguement sake but we go there to kill. Bait or no bait the end result is the same. Unless your deer season is going as crappy as mine lol.
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  #9  
Old 12-07-2017, 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by duckman1911 View Post
Bait or no bait the end result is the same.

I think, with very little effort, that can be argued. I don't feel like making very little effort though.
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  #10  
Old 12-07-2017, 02:17 PM
Smalls Smalls is offline
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Originally Posted by Feesherman View Post
I think, with very little effort, that can be argued. I don't feel like making very little effort though.
I could see from a moral/philosophical standpoint, or from a fair chase standpoint making an argument, but at the bare bones of it, I would agree with him. At the end of the day, you're killing an animal. The difficulty and morality of it can be argued, but the reality is the same.

However, I would make those very arguments myself. I personally don't believe in baiting, or even food plots as we know them commercially. I feel from the fair chase standpoint, hunting over native food sources is more challenging and "fair" to the wildlife, fair being a largely subjective modifier.

I won't fault a guy for using bait or food plots, though, simply because the argument could be made that hunting a hot oak flat or honey locust trees is no different. There is likely a higher degree of difficulty, because food sources can change quickly, but the premise is the same. You are targetting a preferred food source, and in some years, the deer may choose that oak tree over the corn feeder.

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  #11  
Old 12-07-2017, 02:22 PM
Feesherman Feesherman is online now
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Originally Posted by Smalls View Post

I won't fault a guy for using bait or food plots, though, simply because the argument could be made that hunting a hot oak flat or honey locust trees is no different. There is likely a higher degree of difficulty, because food sources can change quickly, but the premise is the same. You are targetting a preferred food source, and in some years, the deer may choose that oak tree over the corn feeder.

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Ok I'll argue a little bit. The man that puts out that corn feeder knows where to go to hunt that corn feeder. It will be there all year long. The hot honey locust tree may never be discovered by a hunter. If it is discovered, it won't be the hot spot for the whole season. It may be discovered too late and the deer may never return to it. The man can sit on that corn feeder all season long and at some point a deer will come to eat his never ending supply. The same cannot be said with certainty for an oak or a honey locust. You can say there is no difference, but in reality...........
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  #12  
Old 12-07-2017, 02:31 PM
Smalls Smalls is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Feesherman View Post
Ok I'll argue a little bit. The man that puts out that corn feeder knows where to go to hunt that corn feeder. It will be there all year long. The hot honey locust tree may never be discovered by a hunter. If it is discovered, it won't be the hot spot for the whole season. It may be discovered too late and the deer may never return to it. The man can sit on that corn feeder all season long and at some point a deer will come to eat his never ending supply. The same cannot be said with certainty for an oak or a honey locust. You can say there is no difference, but in reality...........
But that's exactly what I said. You're arguing whether it's fair chase or not. The argument can only be made that the path to the end result is not the same.

That's not what duckman said. He said the end result is the same, which is the killing of an animal, which there is no guarantee of in either case. I work with a guy that hasn't seen a deer all season at his feeder, but he has them on camera in the area.

I agree with you, but that's not an argument against what he said. That's an argument about the means by which the ends are achieved.

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  #13  
Old 12-07-2017, 02:40 PM
Feesherman Feesherman is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smalls View Post
But that's exactly what I said. You're arguing whether it's fair chase or not. The argument can only be made that the path to the end result is not the same.

That's not what duckman said. He said the end result is the same, which is the killing of an animal, which there is no guarantee of in either case. I work with a guy that hasn't seen a deer all season at his feeder, but he has them on camera in the area.

I agree with you, but that's not an argument against what he said. That's an argument about the means by which the ends are achieved.

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I've expended all my effort. Ya'll keep up the debate.
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  #14  
Old 12-07-2017, 04:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Feesherman View Post
I've expended all my effort. Ya'll keep up the debate.
You bailed way too fast which leads me to believe you are out of options. In my expetience corn feeders do little more than make deer feed at night. Yeah they are still around but you're in bed while they eat in front of your stand. Other than not purposely being cruel to an animal I don't see any moral issue with corn,food plots etc. As I said it's about killing. The morality of it can be debated for eternity. Especially if you ask the deers opinion on it.
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  #15  
Old 12-07-2017, 05:08 PM
Feesherman Feesherman is online now
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Originally Posted by duckman1911 View Post
In my expetience
In all honesty I'm just too dumb to get them big words. Not to mention, I'm off and don't have the need to be entertained anymore

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  #16  
Old 12-07-2017, 05:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Feesherman View Post
In all honesty I'm just too dumb to get them big words. Not to mention, I'm off and don't have the need to be entertained anymore

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L m a o. You got me on that typo for sure. Thankfully you were there to point that out for us. Someone may have been hurt by that. You sir have saved the day. Congrats to you. I know we'll all sleep better knowing you are protecting us from those evil typos. Thank you so very much J
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  #17  
Old 12-07-2017, 05:46 PM
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Feesherman talking about fair chase. 20 bucks says he has never chased a deer. Sitting in a deer stand is what is happening
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  #18  
Old 12-07-2017, 05:52 PM
elebouef elebouef is offline
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Is water melons still against the law to use as bait?
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  #19  
Old 12-07-2017, 06:47 PM
Feesherman Feesherman is online now
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Originally Posted by duckman1911 View Post
Feesherman talking about fair chase. 20 bucks says he has never chased a deer. Sitting in a deer stand is what is happening
I'm your huckleberry. Pay up

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  #20  
Old 12-07-2017, 07:02 PM
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I'm your huckleberry. Pay up

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I'll tell you what. If you have a video to prove you chased a deer on foot just post it and pm me your adress. I will pay you. No bs video you found on youtube or such. If you can be honest and post a video of you chasing down a deer i'll pay up.
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