[AceArcher]

How the heck do you multi-quote... I tried the button at the bottom, can not get it to work.

In any case.....

Originally Posted by MathGeek

Actually, it's much worse than that. Not even much memorization is happening any more. Even things like spelling, multiplication tables, state capitals, and the periodic table that were traditionally memorized are things greatly lacking in most high school graduates. Critical thinking skills are built on some minimal knowledge base. Not even a minimal knowledge base is in place any more, but they do teach pretty good fakery for whatever assessments are used.

It has been a little while since i have been directly involved in any sort of educational system, but if that is truly the state of affairs, then i think that perhaps nothing short of divine intervention is going to help us!

Originally Posted by MathGeek

Each American should feel at complete liberty to bring his faith into the public sphere and political discourse to whatever degree he feels appropriate. Others should not insist matters of faith be left at the doorstep (excluded from public discourse).

Absolutely, just so long as this is not perverted into "Each American who is christian, straight, and has no dubious tendencies"

And you have hit the nail squarely on the head in knowing that I mean that Faith should be left at the doorstep for a discussion like this (public discourse)

Originally Posted by MathGeek

I would go further. One should never endeavor to manipulate governmental powers to suppress the beliefs, expressions, and faith-based practices of your fellow man.



I'd rate character above education. I'd rather produce men and women of the character of those who arrived on the Mayflower rather than the education and character of the average Microsoft employee or silicon valley engineer.



My wife and I have been educational professionals for a long time, and it's a challenge for even us to identify where the teaching profession went wrong in America. It has something to do with the same entitlement mentality and big government foolishness that plagues most of government. You're close to the core problem when you can see how teachers think they should receive the same kudos as public servants that it makes sense to offer soldiers returning home from war.

Agreed on most of the above. What i was referring to as education in all things (books, critical thinking, ability and desire to do mundane things) could perhaps have been said better with the word character. well said.

Originally Posted by MathGeek

Most parents cannot distinguish between the knowledge and skills true education represents, and the diploma and other ways of documenting the knowledge and skills. When push comes to shove, many parents will push for the documentation rather than the actual knowledge.

True, It's a bit hard to get away from this for the average working American. Our society dictates that in almost all cases there should be familys where both adults work full time, A return to a 1 person working family with a parent at home to support and help educate the children would certainly be very helpful

Originally Posted by MathGeek

Wrong, wrong, wrong. Good education creates a fit mind, just as a good workout program creates a fit body. A person with a fit body can quickly learn to excel at sports he has not specifically trained for over many years. Likewise, a fit mind can adapt and acquire new skills and master new disciplines. A strong, disciplined, well trained mind can be produced without tailoring the program to guesses about future job markets.

as stated this was a blurb that i quoted from another on how the education systems of the top two rated countries have achieved those statuses.

they certainly didn't just stat pad the equivilancy test's like we do here, and one could also make the argument that teaching for the future can develop the same "fit mind" that teaching for today does. As your the professional in this department i shall bow to your better judgement.

Originally Posted by MathGeek

To me, these are more parental responsibilities that should be supported and encouraged by the educational system. Marksmanship and archery skills can be added to PE, but on the whole, I'd rather public education focus on reading, writing, history, science, and math.

Agreed, did not mean to infer, that that any of the education parts rest solely on educators and / or parents.

Originally Posted by MathGeek

It depends on where the divisions actually occur. The liberty to choose your friends and associates according to one's personal preferences is fundamental. The personal preferences need not be rational.

I believe this might be the area where we might start to really disagree, Everyone certainly has the right to choose their friends and associates. We wouldn't be human if we didn't.

What i'm referencing, and i think what you would agree with if you thought it over, Is that we need to re-develop our critical thinking skills to get past the messages in the public which say "Hate and distrust everything that is unfamiliar to you"

You don't need to be a conspiracy theorist to easily see that the way our government achieves its goal is by dividing and controlling groups of individuals by playing to things that are important to that group. It has created a "Football" Team mentality in the american voter, Either your playing for the red's or the blue's. If your on one team the other is the embodiment of evil.

The truth is that there are shades of EVERYTHING.....

Originally Posted by MathGeek

This is oversimplified and fails to explain many aspects of the social agendas that are actually bad for business: radical environmentalism, gay marriage, anti-RKBA agendas, etc.

Respectfully, no more oversimplified than thinking that a return to a strictly christian values country is gonna fix everything. I mean lets be honest here, the social agenda's being carried out here in the states, are pretty darn tame compared to some of the social agendas the US attempts to carry out overseas. (think drone strikes with constant civilian collateral deaths etc)

Originally Posted by MathGeek

Too bad they want to legalize drugs.

I can't decide if your saying this in the form of "its a shame they do because if they didn't have this stance they might get elected" or if you say it from the stance that you could not support them since they do favor it.

Either way my opinion falls perfectly in line with theirs.. I will go so far as to say Thank goodness the do want to legalize. Understand something, I am a non user.. (well there was that one time in college sneaking out with a girl who enjoyed an occasional smoke) but i digress....

The war on drugs has done nothing but make hundreds of drug king billionaires, incite what amounts to basically open warfare south of our border, and provide fuel to hasten the stripping of own our citizens rights.

IMO its the proverbial 900lb gorilla in the room.... everyone knows that they are gonna have to recognize it sooner or later.... but no one wants to be the first to do so. Drugs will be legalized in our lifetime, there is simply to much science showing that it MUST be done.

Sadly, there is so much $$$$$$ wrapped up in continuing the "WAR" that it means millions more people are going to pay unnecessary penalties, fines, and prison terms before the nonsense will end. You simply cannot regulate what someone is going to do with there own body. You would think that we would have learned that lesson from prohibition.

Originally Posted by MathGeek

The solution is not primarily political. As Paul Harvey said, (paraphrasing) "Self-government is not possible without self-discipline."

not a follower of him, but this has the makings of a good sound bite.

Originally Posted by MathGeek

Sad, but I think you are probably right. But a more pneumatikos view would be to realize that this fulfills the Biblical expectation that a society will reap what it has sown. After a period of reaping and weeping, repentance and restoration becomes possible.

Then again perhaps its just the law of entropy at work (said with proverbial tongue in cheek)