What Would You Do?

[eman]

I did the same w/ my son when he was in H.S. Except i would not force him to write a report on an African american for "Black history month". Had a great argument w/ his teacher. about why he wouldn't be writing the report. I let her rant and rave about how the black race had been held down by the white man for 150 years. Then i told her that i didn't believe that any race deserved to have their own history month. She stated that blacks deserved it because again they had been held down by the white man for over 150 years. I said ok who held you back from getting a college degree and becoming a teacher? Then after she sputtered and spit because she knew i was right she called me the dreaded word RACIST. Told her no i'm not racist ,i hate everyone equally. Then offered her a deal You find me some one (w/ proof ) that has held black people down since integration and i'll make sure my son writes a report on him / her. Never heard another word about it.

[Clampy]

So you don't think the civil rights movement was anything your kid should have known about ?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[eman]

Originally Posted by Clampy

So you don't think the civil rights movement was anything your kid should have known about ?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

READ MY POST I said that i don't believe that any race should have a "special" month just to highlight their history. It's all american history.
I am of Cherokee descent . I don't believe that the native Americans should have a "special" month just for their history.
Just like i don't believe in a miss Black america pageant or anything that puts one race in front of another.

[duckman1911]

Originally Posted by eman

READ MY POST I said that i don't believe that any race should have a "special" month just to highlight their history. It's all american history.
I am of Cherokee descent . I don't believe that the native Americans should have a "special" month just for their history.
Just like i don't believe in a miss Black america pageant or anything that puts one race in front of another.

Amen brother x1000

[Clampy]

I agree with the right to not say the pledge in Spanish but I hardly think it's a sinister plot to make us speak Spanish or something silly like that.

I'm sure it was just a exercise in saying something in Spanish that is repetitive that's easy to recite and in the long run helps them learn Spanish. It is Spanish class after all.
I took 2 years of requires Spanish and I still can't speak a sentence of it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[duckman1911]

Originally Posted by Clampy

I agree with the right to not say the pledge in Spanish but I hardly think it's a sinister plot to make us speak Spanish or something silly like that.

I'm sure it was just a exercise in saying something in Spanish that is repetitive that's easy to recite and in the long run helps them learn Spanish. It is Spanish class after all.
I took 2 years of requires Spanish and I still can't speak a sentence of it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If or when you have a son then by all means let him sell his principles for a grade. Its your boy so more power to you. It is the principle of it in my view. We are getting closer to full implentation of "common core" which is a huge socialist program. They are slowly dilluting our childrem to be comfy with a one world society. If we wont stand or have the backbone to pet our children stand for their principles then will? Answer that for me.
Clampy keep this in mind. Your worse enemy beats you by being your friend. Ever saw a serial killers neighbor interviewed? They all say he was a good guy that never caused a problem. That analogy might be a stretch.lol

[Clampy]

Well sorry you feel that way but black history month highlights the civil rights movement and is a important part in American history. You know the part where black people were no longer considered less than human.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[eman]

Originally Posted by Clampy

Well sorry you feel that way but black history month highlights the civil rights movement and is a important part in American history. You know the part where black people were no longer considered less than human.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Then why not teach it in American history? Why does it need a special month? I agree that it was an important time in American history. But That's all it is .American history. Just like the trail of tears.

[Clampy]

It's not " black people are awesome month " it's just a reminder of what a race had to go through to get where they are today but I can see why some don't like it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[duckman1911]

eman I understand where you coming from.
Clampy I understand your side too.
Integration was before my time. MLK jr wad a great man but he was a man. If you dig deep enough you will find that black people are the ones that dont want his whole story told. Although he was a good man he wasnt a saint like so called african americans claim he was. If y'all ever meet a real african american I would love to know about it. Charlese Theron is a real african american.

[Ragin_Cajun]

I applaud you and your son for the stance he has taken and your support. I hope he finds a path to the political venue because it it strong fresh minds with conviction that will turn this country around.

It would be just as easy for them to recite any other piece of literature that they have known since birth. How about the Lords Prayer? Ohhhhh.....cant touch that in schools.

My son has been in Franch for the last 3 years and he hasn't recited the National Anthem nor the French Anthem.

IMO....if you really want to know how soft we are.....go to the Middle East and recite their anthem in English and see where that gets you.

Kuddos to your son and you for letting him make a valid and meaningful choice!

IMO....if there is

[speckulator]

it should be said in english. if spanish s******s dont like it mexico aint far. just my thinking

[AceArcher]

The most important things any of us can do when we are raising our kids is to teach them how to be good people.

Some of the core responsibilities of a "good" person in my opinion are.

1) curiosity / a desire and ability to learn

2) tolerance / you must tolerate those different from you so that you can learn from them

3) persistance / the drive to keep going

4) positive attitude/ Can do attitude.

5) critical thinking / how to think for themselves, not just go with the flow.

I think it's also important to recognize that this is really 2 questions and not 1.

1) How do we feel as parents that your son is being asked to recite our pledge in spanish.

2) and is it an actual good learning / tool / aide to help someone learn spanish.

Undoubtably one can say yes to number two, it's a way to associate words of a different language to a known set of words. Thus making inflection, tone, things that are more easily understood in spanish.


On the first question you can really take it both ways.

Is there some big "plot" to turn us all into euro citizens... probably not.

are the spanish people trying to take over the world... probably not.

Is it respectful to say the american pledge in spanish/german/french etc. Me personally i think it's even more respectful than saying it in english. (your saying its not the language but the pledge that is important.)

Is it a little awkward ... certainly so.

I think i look at this situation and i say... Praise your son for having the conviction and the courage to refuse. I would also say that you should encourage your son to understand that from a teaching perspective there is nothing wrong or immoral with him reciting the pledge in german / spanish / french etc.

A real fact of life is that in the future he will need to be comfortable working with many people from many different backgrounds. What better way to make him comfortable than by him putting himself in their "shoes" for a second.

[mcjaredsandwich]

Originally Posted by AceArcher

The most important things any of us can do when we are raising our kids is to teach them how to be good people.

Some of the core responsibilities of a "good" person in my opinion are.

1) curiosity / a desire and ability to learn

2) tolerance / you must tolerate those different from you so that you can learn from them

3) persistance / the drive to keep going

4) positive attitude/ Can do attitude.

5) critical thinking / how to think for themselves, not just go with the flow.

I think it's also important to recognize that this is really 2 questions and not 1.

1) How do we feel as parents that your son is being asked to recite our pledge in spanish.

2) and is it an actual good learning / tool / aide to help someone learn spanish.

Undoubtably one can say yes to number two, it's a way to associate words of a different language to a known set of words. Thus making inflection, tone, things that are more easily understood in spanish.


On the first question you can really take it both ways.

Is there some big "plot" to turn us all into euro citizens... probably not.

are the spanish people trying to take over the world... probably not.

Is it respectful to say the american pledge in spanish/german/french etc. Me personally i think it's even more respectful than saying it in english. (your saying its not the language but the pledge that is important.)

Is it a little awkward ... certainly so.

I think i look at this situation and i say... Praise your son for having the conviction and the courage to refuse. I would also say that you should encourage your son to understand that from a teaching perspective there is nothing wrong or immoral with him reciting the pledge in german / spanish / french etc.

A real fact of life is that in the future he will need to be comfortable working with many people from many different backgrounds. What better way to make him comfortable than by him putting himself in their "shoes" for a second.

best post of this thread...

[MathGeek]

Originally Posted by AceArcher

The most important things any of us can do when we are raising our kids is to teach them how to be good people.

Some of the core responsibilities of a "good" person in my opinion are.

1) curiosity / a desire and ability to learn

2) tolerance / you must tolerate those different from you so that you can learn from them

3) persistance / the drive to keep going

4) positive attitude/ Can do attitude.

5) critical thinking / how to think for themselves, not just go with the flow.

All good stuff. But for me (as a parent and a teacher), conscience comes first.

If a student has an issue of conscience with something, then they need to be free not to participate. Maybe it's a song, maybe sex ed, maybe a movie, maybe a play. In this case, it was reciting the Pledge of Allegiance in Spanish.

We need to protect our children's consciences against intrusions. How can we expect them to resist peer pressure that violates their consciences if we don't support them against governmental (school) pressure that violates their consciences?

Freedom of speech is also freedom not to speak, just as freedom of religion is freedom not to, and freedom of assembly is freedom not to.

My daughter ended up with an "F" for the semester in a course once because she exercised her conscience with regard to a reading assignment. My wife and I were fired from our positions as teachers at the school, because we would not force her to violate her conscience.

[simplepeddler]

Originally Posted by MathGeek

All good stuff. But for me (as a parent and a teacher), conscience comes first.

If a student has an issue of conscience with something, then they need to be free not to participate. Maybe it's a song, maybe sex ed, maybe a movie, maybe a play. In this case, it was reciting the Pledge of Allegiance in Spanish.

We need to protect our children's consciences against intrusions. How can we expect them to resist peer pressure that violates their consciences if we don't support them against governmental (school) pressure that violates their consciences?

Freedom of speech is also freedom not to speak, just as freedom of religion is freedom not to, and freedom of assembly is freedom not to.

My daughter ended up with an "F" for the semester in a course once because she exercised her conscience with regard to a reading assignment. My wife and I were fired from our positions as teachers at the school, because we would not force her to violate her conscience.

it just got real.......

[AceArcher]

Originally Posted by simplepeddler

it just got real.......

Lol why is that.

I think we are all basically in agreement, basically we all support duckmans son making a decision that he feels good about. However i think we all also generally agree that he should be encouraged to expand his horizons, in particular if he is willing he should be encouraged to participate in this activity. Becoming more multicultural and tolerant will only help the young man in the future.

If however we are talking about "forcing" him, against his wishes... then i don't think anyone here thinks that is really a good idea.

[Matt G]

You are a wise man Ace. Great post!

[mcjaredsandwich]

relevant

[Clampy]

Look I can kinda see where you coming from e man but I hardly see it as something to be so upset about. A small consolidation for the brutal period a whole race of people had to endure.

Thanks ace you always say it better than I can.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk