CWD and proposed ban.

[DaPointIsDaBomb]

Originally Posted by Andy C

Again it's not a problem yes white tail get get moved around, so what's the problem ? It's nothing new!! Did anyone in Rio get zijie.. no it's all bull s.....

Amen brother. Zila was another fake disease made up to put fear in people

[Feesherman]

Originally Posted by DaPointIsDaBomb

Amen brother. Zila was another fake disease made up to put fear in people

What about zijie?

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[DaPointIsDaBomb]

Originally Posted by Feesherman

What about zijie?

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It's fake. Like Ebola and bird flu. Government tries to scare us with it and then it magically goes away.

[Andy C]

Originally Posted by Feesherman

What about zijie?

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You haven't heard about that yet?? Oh your doomed, better try to save your friends and family!!! You must have it and by Saturday you will be a goner!!! Spread the word about this new" bug running wild in the human population before it's to late!!!!

O wait that's just the internet and media trying to scare people into more regulations, !!!

[Smalls]

Originally Posted by noodle creek

https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=...&v=1_ltc3dNsPk

Smalls and everyone else who thinks CWD might even have the smallest chance of ruiningour deer hunting please watch this video and come back with opinions after watching.

Just want honest opinions.

You should probably read earlier in this thread where I addressed Ted's article as well as this video.

These people want to talk about the constitution being violated and deer being private property. Deer are not private property. Wildlife is not private property. The land those deer are on may be private, but the deer are not. Wildlife is a Public Trust...no one owns it.

Keith Warren, just like other people in that video, is a deer farmer. He does not have the public's interest at heart. He only has his and other wildlife horders' interests at heart.

The only thing that should be of "great concern" to anyone after watching this video is that Mr. Warren views wildlife as private property. This is not feudal Europe...wildlife cannot be owned by the rich or royal here. That is specifically why we have the Public Trust Doctrine.



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[noodle creek]

Originally Posted by Smalls

You should probably read earlier in this thread where I addressed Ted's article as well as this video.

These people want to talk about the constitution being violated and deer being private property. Deer are not private property. Wildlife is not private property. The land those deer are on may be private, but the deer are not. Wildlife is a Public Trust...no one owns it.

Keith Warren, just like other people in that video, is a deer farmer. He does not have the public's interest at heart. He only has his and other wildlife horders' interests at heart.

The only thing that should be of "great concern" to anyone after watching this video is that Mr. Warren views wildlife as private property. This is not feudal Europe...wildlife cannot be owned by the rich or royal here. That is specifically why we have the Public Trust Doctrine.



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I think you're trying to stretch this, and not everyone in there was a deer farmer. The whole private property thing was a small part of it. He was simply telling us about the (and yes it is pretty unconstitutional) story of a government agency quarantining private property for no reason. I guess you'reokay with that too though.

How bout the fact that the herds in the wild that have CWD have actually grown in size? What about all of the other facts about CWD, not private property, that were discussed? Looks like as far as I can tell there is no way to stop it, and it is a tiny tiny threat to deer herds compared to other things. This thread is about CWD and carrying deer across borders, not private property.

I hope you can agree that what the DNR did in Iowa was wrong, and the way that CWD was treated is Wisconsin was an extreme overreaction that didnway more damage than CWD ever would.

Who is to gain from CWD? Like stated in the video, I think it's pretty hard to argue the fact that at one point it was such a big deal that it negatively affected deer hunting.

[Smalls]

Never said I agreed with the Fed quarantining a property. Then again, if it is a potentially deadly disease (not referring to any disease in particular), then it may be warranted. I'm not sure CWD is that disease, but if we can prevent any disease from getting into our deer herd, I'm for it.

You point out that this thread is about carrying deer across borders and not private property. Then why post that video, which was created by deer farmers?

You asked the million dollar question that none of these people can answer...if it is some concocted disease, what is the end goal?

Answer that.

Hey, I guess the Norwegians are in on it, too.

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[noodle creek]

Originally Posted by Smalls

Never said I agreed with the Fed quarantining a property. Then again, if it is a potentially deadly disease (not referring to any disease in particular), then it may be warranted. I'm not sure CWD is that disease, but if we can prevent any disease from getting into our deer herd, I'm for it.

You point out that this thread is about carrying deer across borders and not private property. Then why post that video, which was created by deer farmers?

You asked the million dollar question that none of these people can answer...if it is some concocted disease, what is the end goal?

Answer that.

Hey, I guess the Norwegians are in on it, too.

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I don't think it was a created disease, I think it is a disease that has been around forever and we just didn't know about it. I think it warrants no threat to our deer herds, and obviously has been studied enough to know that this is most likely true. If we start letting the gov restrict and ban things every time there is the smallest chance on earth something will happen, then pretty soon we won't be able to hunt or fish at all.

[Smalls]

Originally Posted by noodle creek

I don't think it was a created disease, I think it is a disease that has been around forever and we just didn't know about it. I think it warrants no threat to our deer herds, and obviously has been studied enough to know that this is most likely true. If we start letting the gov restrict and ban things every time there is the smallest chance on earth something will happen, then pretty soon we won't be able to hunt or fish at all.

So, what do you make of this article?

http://www.prwatch.org/news/2013/06/...-infect-humans

From a half a percent in 2002 to over 5% in 2012. Thats a 10-fold increase in 10 years.

I don't think we know everything about this disease. I don't think we know how it's spread so sporadically, yet managed to find its way into 23 states. So I DEFINITELY don't think we know enough to know how severe it could become under the right conditions.

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[noodle creek]

First paragraph of that article compares it to mad cow disease and once again tries to scare people into thinking it could jump species. (It could, but it's highly unlikely and hasn't happened yet). Also, this was a much smaller sample size, and even if it has increased, it hasn't affected the herd. There was an elk herd in South Dakota that had a much larger population that tested positive, and what happened, you guessed it, the herd thrived.

To date, I think I read earlier in another article, that of all samples in every animal they have taken since they started studying it, right around 1% have tested positive.

[Smalls]

Originally Posted by noodle creek

First paragraph of that article compares it to mad cow disease and once again tries to scare people into thinking it could jump species. (It could, but it's highly unlikely and hasn't happened yet). Also, this was a much smaller sample size, and even if it has increased, it hasn't affected the herd. There was an elk herd in South Dakota that had a much larger population that tested positive, and what happened, you guessed it, the herd thrived.

To date, I think I read earlier in another article, that of all samples in every animal they have taken since they started studying it, right around 1% have tested positive.

You do realize that CWD and Mad Cow are the same type of disease right? You said it yourself, they have not proven that it CANNOT jump. I don't agree with scare tactics, but being informed of POTENTIAL hazards is never a bad thing.

Again, I'm not arguing that it has brought disaster on a herd. But why is it more prevalent in some herds than others? What if the right situation presented itself for this disease to do a lot of damage to a herd?

What is an acceptable number of deer dying by this disease, in your opinion? Keep in mind, deer likely won't just die by this disease, but by hunting, predation, old age, other diseases, collisions with vehicles. This disease can infect any age class. Older deer appear to be more susceptible to it (likely due to decreased vigor).

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[Top Dawg]

A lot of what ifs.

[Andy C]

Originally Posted by Smalls

You do realize that CWD and Mad Cow are the same type of disease right? You said it yourself, they have not proven that it CANNOT jump. I don't agree with scare tactics, but being informed of POTENTIAL hazards is never a bad thing.

Again, I'm not arguing that it has brought disaster on a herd. But why is it more prevalent in some herds than others? What if the right situation presented itself for this disease to do a lot of damage to a herd?

What is an acceptable number of deer dying by this disease, in your opinion? Keep in mind, deer likely won't just die by this disease, but by hunting, predation, old age, other diseases, collisions with vehicles. This disease can infect any age class. Older deer appear to be more susceptible to it (likely due to decreased vigor).

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What if what if?? What if we ban car's from hitting deer, what if we just ban car's??? WHAT if WHAT
If what if, let's put signs up so deer won't Cross the roads and get hit!!! This as always been around and always will be it's nothing to worry about unless you make your money deer hunting and even then it's nothing too worry about!!

[Smalls]

Originally Posted by Andy C

What if what if?? What if we ban car's from hitting deer, what if we just ban car's??? WHAT if WHAT
If what if, let's put signs up so deer won't Cross the roads and get hit!!! This as always been around and always will be it's nothing to worry about unless you make your money deer hunting and even then it's nothing too worry about!!

One "What if" in my entire post, smartass.

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[Andy C]

But that's what your saying!! Anything can happen, and there's nothing anyone can do about it!! It's scare media and bull ....... so why even buy into it??

[Smalls]

Originally Posted by Andy C

But that's what your saying!! Anything can happen, and there's nothing anyone can do about it!! It's scare media and bull ....... so why even buy into it??

Where did I say anything can happen? My point is, people want to brush off a disease because of the supposedly minor number of deaths caused without taking into account all of the other causes of mortality. We have somewhere between 750k and 1 million deer. Harvest estimates are typically somewhere between 100k and 150k. That is anywhere from 10-20% of the population. That does not take into account any other mortality.

So, again, what is an acceptable level of mortality from a disease? Maybe it's not all additive, but you have to make that decision as a manager. Is it an acceptable loss compared to what you may lose by managing to prevent it.

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[noodle creek]

Rabies, blue tongue, and a few other diseases kill wayyy more deer than CWD. There a lot lot of things we still don't know about those things either. Maybe we should stop deer hunting all together, might get rabies or die of blue tongue.

I'm not saying there is no such thing, but bottom line is, there are 10 million different things that "could" go wrong, not just CWD. Can't start putting restrictions on everything that mighttt possibly go wrong. It's absurd and it's how our right slowly trickle away from us. Better show some sound science before they take these routes.

Last post on this topic.

[Andy C]

Originally Posted by noodle creek

Rabies, blue tongue, and a few other diseases kill wayyy more deer than CWD. There a lot lot of things we still don't know about those things either. Maybe we should stop deer hunting all together, might get rabies or die of blue tongue.

I'm not saying there is no such thing, but bottom line is, there are 10 million different things that "could" go wrong, not just CWD. Can't start putting restrictions on everything that mighttt possibly go wrong. It's absurd and it's how our right slowly trickle away from us. Better show some sound science before they take these routes.

Last post on this topic.

what I have been trying to tell him, you said it way better. guess you can't fix dumb tho!!

[Smalls]

Originally Posted by Andy C

what I have been trying to tell him, you said it way better. guess you can't fix dumb tho!!

You've compared domestic meat to wild meat, insinuated that CWD managed to make it across the continent because "wild meat moves where it wants, when it wants", and have contributed relatively nothing but useless dribble to this conversation, yet I'm the dumb one?

Yeah, ok pal. That C must stand for "Crap".

I'm done with this conversation.

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[Andy C]

It's is hard to even control illness in domestic meat, that is highly regulated, so to think think that you or anyone can control it in a wild heard don't make any sense to me!! If we can't control domestic illness that are common to wild meat,how should we go about doing it in the wild???