Answering the Libertarian argument for drug legalization

[Clampy]

Doesn't cause lung cancer http://www.thoracic....ung-cancer.html
Doesn't cause lung cancer http://www.sciam.com...55F83414B7F0000
Doesn't cause brain damage http://www.webmd.com...nt-damage-brain
Negligible risk http://norml.org/ind...m?Group_ID=4305
Minimal Effect on Central Nervous System http://www.scienceda...30630112652.htm
Doesn't cause oral cancer http://www.news.uiuc...oralcancer.html
Doesn't cause cancer http://www.umich.edu...t16_06/01.shtml
Pot shrinks tumors http://www.alternet.org/story/9257/
Government perspective http://www.nida.nih..../marijuana.html
Negligible consequences of using marijuana when pregnant http://www.mothering...uana-side4.html
Doesn't cause cancer

YouTube - Marijuana Study Shows No Lung Cancer Links

YouTube - Marijuana Study Shows No Lung Cancer Links

Doesn’t cause cancer even though contains more carcinogens http://health.dailyn...iew/0002267/61/

[MathGeek]

Proverbs 25:28
Like a city whose walls are broken through is a person who lacks self-control.

Acts 24:25
As Paul talked about righteousness, self-control and the judgment to come, Felix was afraid and said, “That’s enough for now! You may leave."

[Clampy]

Most all from legitimate sources. Unlike yours. Even NIDA.

[Top Dawg]

I'm not and never have been a pot user. So I think ill just sit back have a cold one and watch as this train wreck unfolds.

[Clampy]

Originally Posted by Top Dawg

I'm not and never have been a pot user. So I think ill just sit back have a cold one and watch as this train wreck unfolds.

You don't have to be.
Just ask yourself this question.

" do you support putting adults in a cage for use of a substance safer than alcohol ?"

I'm done. I will let math geek post a couple of pages of trash before I get back in it.

[MissSmallAimsSmall]

"We conclude that the use of marijuana or cocaine during pregnancy is associated with impaired fetal growth and that measuring a biologic marker of such use is important to demonstrate the association"-Effects of Maternal Marijuana and Cocaine Use on Fetal Growth

[southern151]

Originally Posted by MissSmallAimsSmall

"We conclude that the use of marijuana or cocaine during pregnancy is associated with impaired fetal growth and that measuring a biologic marker of such use is important to demonstrate the association"-Effects of Maternal Marijuana and Cocaine Use on Fetal Growth

Ya don't say?! No one here suggested using any type of anything while pregnant.

What started out as an interesting debate has turned into a copy and paste fest that is so mind-numbingly boring that I feel like I smoked a quarter and sat down to read Google from front to back!

I guess I'll go get a beer, get pregnant and, hop in a 747 and, fly away.

[Goooh]

I'm going to go out on a limb here, and just assume that "Miss" is actually MG's wife that signed up today to join in converting us all to the moral high ground.

I know i shouldn't assume, but it seems really coincidental that someone be lurking on an outdoor site with an agenda to start posting so called scientific data in an attempt to shoot down everyone else's opinion on pot.... And the Handle (Miss) is a play on words from a post MG had.

I'm out, this thread is high.

[hawgsquatch]

Originally Posted by Finfeatherfur

Here is my perspective:

I put my self through school working as a deputy sheriff. Once through paramedic school I worked as a medic for both private ambulance services, finally ending my medical career in civil service work in a big city. After 15 years of medical calls and thousands of overdoses, I have never - EVER - transported or arrested someone overdosed on marijuana. Why? Because it is impossible to do! You will go to sleep before you stop breathing. I have run hundreds of calls, and had 3 that were fatal from acute alcohol poisioning. I have also transported more patients on prescrition Rx overdoses then I care to discuss.

Now that I am an oilfield guy, working part time in LE as a hobby, I see the problems from all angles. As an employer, we are forced to conduct drug testing on workers. Yet I can have a guy high as a kite continue to work because he has a prescription from a quack of a doctor. BUT, a man who has worked his entire life will go bankrupt trying to fight cancer and is arrested if he has some ganja to help with his side effects of chemo. Yet, we can make an arrest of a known drug dealer carrying 500lbs, to have the case plea bargained down to a simple possession and get their vehicle back.

To make matters worse, I can be sued and loose everything for having some leach of society video me trying to take a combative 25 y/o into custody who is naked in the street high on bath salts trying to eat my face that was tazed 4 times with no effect, so we go hands on, fighting for our life. The residents of the tax paid housing complex called us to deal with these people, but when we are on the ground fighting to control the maniac, they only film to have document for an attorney and offer no assistance to gain control of the subject.

Or how about the criminal drug dealer that has no job, owns 5 vehicles over $50k, and gets out of jail before the paperwork is complete for selling Roxi's to kids under 18y/o.

Do I like what I see - hellll no! Can it be fixed? At this point I am not so sure. I do know that I am more worried about 2 things right now more than anything:
1)- The abuse of prescription pills is staggering and out of control, with no end in sight. Yet, the DEA and FDA continue to allow it to happen.
2)- If this country doesn't do something really fast with the METH epidemic coming on so strong and fast, marijuana will be the last thing on their mind! I have never seen people as desperate as a METH head trying to score. It is very scary to see, and most have children that are getting stuck in the middle.

This rant is my opinion only, and not associated with the thoughts or ideas of others associated with any employers I have. I will continue to fight the war on drugs in this capacity and will remain vigilant in that fight. I will obey orders of my superiors and try to raise my kids in a manner that leads them down an honorable and successful path in life. With the help of GOD and my wife, I hope I am successful.

I hear you man I live and work in Humboldt County, the weed capital of the world. I personally do not think the suff is any worse than any other addictive poison, but I cannot get over the attitudes of the gowers. It is a for profit scheme and they will do anythng to make a buck. They do not pay taxes, and every time I see a guy come in with five hunderd pounds of weed and a food stamp card and state funded medical card it disgusts me. The worst thing that ever could happen to these guys is if weed was legalized and Pfizer and Pepsico took over the market. They also don't care whose water they poison or how much wildlife they kill, as long as they are able to make that all powerful buck. Scum of the Earth in my very educated opinion.

I appreciate your opinion MathGeek and I understand your motivation. I just absolutely will not tolerate a government that is strong enough to enforce a moral or theological system. I think that by raising our kids to be smart and make righteous decisions, we are winning the war far more than by making laws that cannot be enforced without draconian measures.

As far as the weed worshipers are concerned:

It aint medicine.
It don't cure cancer.
Smoking anything is unhealthy.
It doesn't help autistic children, any more than any sedative. Parents who give thier kids weed in any form for any reason are abusive.
It is availiable via prescription as Marinol to help chemo patients.
It is addictive.
Weed smells bad and when you don't notice it anymore that is how we know you are an addict.
Porn, booze, pizza, candybars, and fishing are addictive too. I don't want to outlaw any of those things either, whether I agree with them on a moral basis or not.

I love battles of wit.... Especially when I am better armed than my opponents.

[mcjaredsandwich]

Originally Posted by hawgsquatch

I hear you man I live and work in Humboldt County, the weed capital of the world. I personally do not think the suff is any worse than any other addictive poison, but I cannot get over the attitudes of the gowers. It is a for profit scheme and they will do anythng to make a buck. They do not pay taxes, and every time I see a guy come in with five hunderd pounds of weed and a food stamp card and state funded medical card it disgusts me. The worst thing that ever could happen to these guys is if weed was legalized and Pfizer and Pepsico took over the market. They also don't care whose water they poison or how much wildlife they kill, as long as they are able to make that all powerful buck. Scum of the Earth in my very educated opinion.

I appreciate your opinion MathGeek and I understand your motivation. I just absolutely will not tolerate a government that is strong enough to enforce a moral or theological system. I think that by raising our kids to be smart and make righteous decisions, we are winning the war far more than by making laws that cannot be enforced without draconian measures.

As far as the weed worshipers are concerned:

It aint medicine.
It don't cure cancer.
Smoking anything is unhealthy.
It doesn't help autistic children, any more than any sedative. Parents who give thier kids weed in any form for any reason are abusive.
It is availiable via prescription as Marinol to help chemo patients.
It is addictive.
Weed smells bad and when you don't notice it anymore that is how we know you are an addict.
Porn, booze, pizza, candybars, and fishing are addictive too. I don't want to outlaw any of those things either, whether I agree with them on a moral basis or not.

I love battles of wit.... Especially when I am better armed than my opponents.

If smoking is unhealthy, edibles. Smells bad?? You've never smoked good weed. And addictive? Lmao x 100000

[Top Dawg]

Pot smokers be angry!!

[ckinchen]

Closed by original posters request.

[ckinchen]

I was finally able to read some of the content, in between naps of course, no offense MG.....

The thread is open again, easy on the personal attacks.

[MissSmallAimsSmall]

Originally Posted by Goooh

I'm going to go out on a limb here, and just assume that "Miss" is actually MG's wife that signed up today to join in converting us all to the moral high ground.

I know i shouldn't assume, but it seems really coincidental that someone be lurking on an outdoor site with an agenda to start posting so called scientific data in an attempt to shoot down everyone else's opinion on pot.... And the Handle (Miss) is a play on words from a post MG had.

I'm out, this thread is high.

I am not Mathgeek's wife. Most southern gentlemen would say that "Miss" refers to a single woman.

It was AceArcher who referred to the phrase "aim small miss small" in post 62, not MG. The origin of my handle was from the movie "The Patriot".

mel gibson the patriot tomahawk fight scenes - YouTube

mel gibson the patriot tomahawk fight scenes - YouTube

[MissSmallAimsSmall]

Originally Posted by southern151

Ya don't say?! No one here suggested using any type of anything while pregnant.

What started out as an interesting debate has turned into a copy and paste fest that is so mind-numbingly boring that I feel like I smoked a quarter and sat down to read Google from front to back!

I guess I'll go get a beer, get pregnant and, hop in a 747 and, fly away.

In post 141, Clampy had a link to a page that supposedly had "evidence" of "Negligible consequences of using marijuana when pregnant."

Earlier in this thread, the lack of scientific support for pot regulation was noted multiple times. I have posted 7 quotes directly from scientific papers... not too much when you think about the number of replies in this thread. A respectful discussion can include scientific sources, personal experience, and whatever other contributions others may have to the conversation.

[Clampy]

Here is 3 rebuttals to my " highly educated & better witted " friend
Hawgsquatch

Humbolt growers don't want legal weed because they would be out of biz. All the problems you listed are directly prohibition related. If they didn't have to hide in the forest and run from law enforcement They wouldn't have to carry guns and make pollution. Every other legal business is highly regulated why wouldn't the cannabis industry.


http://www.examiner.com/article/top-...a-dispensaries

Shame on these parents for abusing there son. The kid literally beats himself into walls and cannabis is the only thing that works. It's ABUSE not to give the kid the medicine.


http://www.kptv.com/story/20660400/m...-manage-autism



Down from 300 seizures a week to just 1
Abuse ?

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/3734283

[Clampy]

Originally Posted by MissSmallAimsSmall

In post 141, Clampy had a link to a page that supposedly had "evidence" of "Negligible consequences of using marijuana when pregnant."

Earlier in this thread, the lack of scientific support for pot regulation was noted multiple times. I have posted 7 quotes directly from scientific papers... not too much when you think about the number of replies in this thread. A respectful discussion can include scientific sources, personal experience, and whatever other contributions others may have to the conversation.

Uhh. Duh. Are these seriously your arguments to put adults in cages ?

No one is advocating pot use while pregnant. Those scientific papers you site or from an addiction centers of course drugs are bad. They need biz.

Try again smalls

[Goooh]

Good, time for church.

Thought he was making fun until he started spitting scriptures, lmao

http://youtu.be/C-uftiQAODc

[Goooh]

Originally Posted by MissSmallAimsSmall

I am not Mathgeek's wife. Most southern gentlemen would say that "Miss" refers to a single woman.

It was AceArcher who referred to the phrase "aim small miss small" in post 62, not MG. The origin of my handle was from the movie "The Patriot". mel gibson the patriot tomahawk fight scenes - YouTube

You are right, but in my defense I had been up for about 30 hours and was super stoned when I posted.

[MathGeek]

You guys may want to be more careful before posting material that might provide probable cause of drug use to enforcement agencies inclined to search homes and vehicles for contraband and to revoke business licenses for such things. Your IP addresses and real identities are likely easily discovered unless you are taking active steps (ie: tor, proxy servers) to preserve your privacy.

I haven't followed up every citation, but some of the material being discussed in support of dangers of cannabis has been published by the Lancet, New England Journal of Medicine, and the National Academy of Sciences.

My wife definitely supports my efforts in this discussion, providing many insights and scientific views, but alas, the Harvard PhD has not rolled up her sleeves and personally joined the discussion. "SaltyCajun" is often too "Salty" for her, but she enjoys vicarious participation through me and meeting folks at Calcasieu Point.

I am surprised that the forum which has appreciated scientific pastes and input in threads regarding the 15 trout limit in Big Lake, the overharvesting of oysters in Big Lake, and red snapper and tripletail discussions suddenly seem to be balking at a little science when the subject is drug legalization.