East Side your Limit drop is comming

["W"]

Reason so much land is lost is due to Man made structures and changing mother nature natural flow.

Will man fix this? No
Will man change this ?No
Man has destroyed our own land ....

And what did we get out of all the land loss on the east side??? New Orleans

[Reefman]

Originally Posted by ckinchen

They already have their own experts on the "payroll", do they need more? It seems like what they need to do is to take action against erosion sice we all know that is an issue, biology degree not required. First your Governor will need to out the large sum of money Bp provided into the estuary as it was designated in the first place.

More state or government jobs is the last thing Louisiana needs.

I really like this post!!!!! Give them time and our politicians will rob these funds dry. Need this money to fund the pensions and retirements of guberment jobs! In the end this issue will become totally political based with every coastal representative pegging special pet projects with whatever money is left over from the pillaged funds. We have a golden opportunity to use these funds for stopping the washing away of our coast line along with improving the habitat. I have very little faith that the La. goberment will do the right thing.

[Dink]

Blow the mississippi river levee south of Baton Rouge. Let the river do what it wants......

[Captain Brian]

Originally Posted by Dink

Blow the mississippi river levee south of Baton Rouge. Let the river do what it wants......

That's about the size of it,if you really want to fix it.

[Montauk17]

Originally Posted by Dink

Blow the mississippi river levee south of Baton Rouge. Let the river do what it wants......

Won't happen though....too many people live south of baton rouge. Not to mention how long it would take for land to build up. Most of the coast is too far gone to save. Just look at the wax lake outlet....it was dug in the 1940's and it took that long for land to build up to what it is today. But that really is the only answer IMO....wax lake area is the only part of the state building land.

[YellaBlazer]

Originally Posted by Dink

Blow the mississippi river levee south of Baton Rouge. Let the river do what it wants......

I don't know about BR, but definitely south of Port Sulphur on both sides of the river.

[Duck Butter]

Originally Posted by MathGeek

I understand the temptation to lower limits because it is an easy answer and at least represents "doing something" when faced with the concern of the future of a fishery. Unfortunately, government types are often too quick to give into this temptation because rule changes are cheaper and easier than thorough stock assessments and good science. The esturaries and future of the fisheries would be better served if we pressured the government types to conduct, publish, and explain thorough stock assessments rather than pressuring for rule changes in their absence.

This^, the squeaky wheel gets the grease and in Louisiana its politics, not science based 'greasing'.

I don't think that a change in limits will do one thing, whether the limit is 5 or 50, take by legal fishing means is not even a drop in the bucket in the overall trout population. These fish grow fast, have lots of little trout at a relatively early age, and can spawn multiple times, so recreational fishing does very little. Habitat is infinitely more important.

One more thing is the oil spill and the Corexit, there are studies out there that are showing impacts of this stuff. I listened to an entymologist talk about not being able to find any insects around the areas where oil was present. It sounds minor, but this is the basis of the food chain. You know that if you ever walk in the marsh, there is no shortage of insects. And also, oil from the Macondo spill washes up on Elmer's and Grand Isle every time there is a storm and will probably be like that for many years

[Duck Butter]

Originally Posted by YellaBlazer

I don't know about BR, but definitely south of Port Sulphur on both sides of the river.

Yep, the solution is simple but its just dealing with the people. The Coastal Master Plan outlines many of the projects that they are planning. Maybe some of the plan will get going soon

[Super Spook]

Originally Posted by Duck Butter

This^, the squeaky wheel gets the grease and in Louisiana its politics, not science based 'greasing'.

I don't think that a change in limits will do one thing, whether the limit is 5 or 50, take by legal fishing means is not even a drop in the bucket in the overall trout population. These fish grow fast, have lots of little trout at a relatively early age, and can spawn multiple times, so recreational fishing does very little. Habitat is infinitely more important.

One more thing is the oil spill and the Corexit, there are studies out there that are showing impacts of this stuff. I listened to an entymologist talk about not being able to find any insects around the areas where oil was present. It sounds minor, but this is the basis of the food chain. You know that if you ever walk in the marsh, there is no shortage of insects. And also, oil from the Macondo spill washes up on Elmer's and Grand Isle every time there is a storm and will probably be like that for many years

I agree with you and Mathgeek. I have heard several other biologist say the same thing. Mathgeek, if they try to do something stupid with state limits not based on science or facts on the population you need to get involved.

["W"]

Originally Posted by Duck Butter

This^, the squeaky wheel gets the grease and in Louisiana its politics, not science based 'greasing'.

I don't think that a change in limits will do one thing, whether the limit is 5 or 50, take by legal fishing means is not even a drop in the bucket in the overall trout population. These fish grow fast, have lots of little trout at a relatively early age, and can spawn multiple times, so recreational fishing does very little. Habitat is infinitely more important.

One more thing is the oil spill and the Corexit, there are studies out there that are showing impacts of this stuff. I listened to an entymologist talk about not being able to find any insects around the areas where oil was present. It sounds minor, but this is the basis of the food chain. You know that if you ever walk in the marsh, there is no shortage of insects. And also, oil from the Macondo spill washes up on Elmer's and Grand Isle every time there is a storm and will probably be like that for many years

Well I need two truck loads of corexit ..because we have skkeeters thick thick thick in freezing weather here at the lake

[Duck Butter]

Originally Posted by "W"

Well I need two truck loads of corexit ..because we have skkeeters thick thick thick in freezing weather here at the lake

, the lack of insects was thought to be from the vapors the oil and Corexit were producing. I have the results written down somewhere, but she did an experiment in the lab with just oil and then with various percentages of Corexit. It took a much smaller amount of Corexit to kill the insects than was present in the marsh. Much of these oil spill studies seem to be hush hush due to a gag order but in the end hopefully the findings will be shown to the public. The state agencies are/were performing studies on everything (fish, birds, shrimp, crabs, etc.) and then BP hired outside consultants to perform similar studies to show their data as well just in case there are conflicting results.

[MathGeek]

I appreciate everyone's input and perspectives. There is a lot of value in this conversation.

Originally Posted by Duck Butter

... the squeaky wheel gets the grease and in Louisiana its politics, not science based 'greasing'.

I am optimistic that Louisiana is growing in positive directions under Governor Jindal. It may take time, but I think the more and higher quality science we can have in the conversation, the better the odds for a favorable outcome.

Originally Posted by Duck Butter

One more thing is the oil spill and the Corexit, there are studies out there that are showing impacts of this stuff. I listened to an entymologist talk about not being able to find any insects around the areas where oil was present. It sounds minor, but this is the basis of the food chain. You know that if you ever walk in the marsh, there is no shortage of insects.

When we were weighing and measuring all the fish in our oil spill study, we took note of the lack of insects, which we attributed to the lack of local rainfall. It's good to know that there is an alternate explanation with some science behind it.

Originally Posted by Dink

Blow the mississippi river levee south of Baton Rouge. Let the river do what it wants......

Now this is out of the box thinking.

Originally Posted by ckinchen

They already have their own experts on the "payroll", do they need more? ...

More state or government jobs is the last thing Louisiana needs.

I agree completely. The State of Louisiana has too many employees already, and when your paycheck is coming from the State, it is much harder giving truly independent scientific input. Wildlife management is more likely to be improved with a combination of independent science as well as improved state sponsored science.

As we exercise our political clout, I think we would better serve future generations not by saying "raise the limits" or "lower the limits" but rather by saying "show me the science."

Practice a bit if jumping up and down like Cuba Gooding in Jerry McGuire:

Show me the science!

Show me the science!

Show me the science!

["W"]

Originally Posted by MathGeek

Practice a bit if jumping up and down like Cuba Gooding in Jerry McGuire:

Show me the science!

Show me the science!

Show me the science!

[meaux fishing]

Say what you want but I have every confidence that the state biologists have all the capacity to make the right recommendations. I also know that the head biologist is an avid trout fisherman as he was one of the people that taught me to fish. He also worked out of the grand isle biology station for a long time so is very familiar with that area. I know he will not recommend a limit change unless it is absolutely necessary. What the politicians do is another story however.,,,

[Kajundave]

10X what Reefman said

[Duck Butter]

Originally Posted by meaux fishing

Say what you want but I have every confidence that the state biologists have all the capacity to make the right recommendations. I also know that the head biologist is an avid trout fisherman as he was one of the people that taught me to fish. He also worked out of the grand isle biology station for a long time so is very familiar with that area. I know he will not recommend a limit change unless it is absolutely necessary. What the politicians do is another story however.,,,

I agree with this also, it is not the biologists by any means. LDWF has some great staff and Dr. Horst is one of the best and in his article he does mention how limits are set (SPR) and then what the current SPR is and what the SPRs are for other states and how they set their limits. The biologists gather as much data as they can and then they present the data to the Commission and then the Commission decides on the plan. These meetings are at the LDWF headquarters in BR and open to the public. The commissioners vote on the proposals. The commissioners are not wildlife professionals and never have been, they are appointed officials. These are the folks who make the decisions. You can look on wlf.la.gov and check out when the meetings are and what they are proposing for each meeting.

[eman]

Originally Posted by "W"

MathGeek, could WL&F afford to put you on pay roll?? And why don't you pursue a job like this ?

They don't listen to the experts they have on the payroll now???

[Duck Butter]

[QUOTE=MathGeek;555413]


When we were weighing and measuring all the fish in our oil spill study, we took note of the lack of insects, which we attributed to the lack of local rainfall. It's good to know that there is an alternate explanation with some science behind it.

Here is the professor
http://www.lsuagcenter.com/en/commun...rs/LHooper.htm

She was also looking at ants on the beach at Grand Isle and she was having problems finding ants after the spill and after the cleanup, suggesting there was something going on that we couldn't see. This was last August when she spoke so she probably has much more info now.

[TarponTom]

What many people don't realize is the cleanup crews are picking up between 700 to 900 pounds of oil every single day on Fourchon Beach, & Elmers Island alone. Every the tide goes out oil balls are all over the beaches again. I have also seen a significant reduction in the menhaden population in the Lake P, Borgne, and Venice areas. The population is easily 1/2 of what it was in 2005 and I'm positive this is due to the oil spill and corexit.

A reduced creel limit of trout to 5 per person with strict minimum and maximum size limits will occur within the next 48 months. The trout & menhaden aren't the only fish to have taken a hit either--the flounder fishery is in real trouble.

[Ray]

Corexit is not as hazardous as people think. And if it wasn't used, there would have been a lot more oil on the beaches and bays.
Just a few bbls of Corexit in billions of bbls of water in the GOM is not as toxic as what the oil companies, menhaden boats and work boats dumped in the GOM in the 60's and 70's, when the fish populations were way higher than now.
In my opinion, non regulated commercial fishing in those days, and killing of Snapper in Shrimp nets is the cause.
Having to throw back dead bycatch on a Shrimp boatis stupid. They should have been able to sell it.
AND, blasting/removing platforms instead of toppling them and making artificial reefs was not so good of an idea either. Fish need habitat or they will move away.