looking for natural gas boiler

[keakar]

I am on a tight budget and so i need to do this for under $100. right now I have a cheapo very "basic" propane burner and an 80 quart boiling pot.

I would like to avoid buying propane tanks for boiling seafood. I figure even if its not cheaper then propane, a natural gas seafood boiler is going to be a lot less trouble then messing with those tanks.

the trouble is I don't know anything about natural gas burners so most of what I have seen are just the natural gas burner jet rings that I assume you unscrew and swap out the propane burner or maybe you are supposed to build your own burner or something.

do you buy and screw one of these burner jet rings onto one of those cheap propane burners or just buy a complete natural gas boiler setup and where do you get them at a good price?

also, do cooking times go way up with nat gas or are they able to put out just as much heat as propane

[lil bubba]

All you need to boil with nat. gas is a 1/2 or 3/4 pipe with a cap and drill a 1/8 in. hole in the cap.....Nat. gas works with propane cooking burner too but I have found not as hot...Ace in laplace sells a burner replacement that has a bunch of brass nozzles or whatever they called....I don't know how it would work on standard home gas line but I know a guy uses it for his store to cook n boil and it is hotter than hell....Seems to be hotter than standard propane....

[keakar]

Originally Posted by lil bubba

All you need to boil with nat. gas is a 1/2 or 3/4 pipe with a cap and drill a 1/8 in. hole in the cap.....Nat. gas works with propane cooking burner too but I have found not as hot...Ace in laplace sells a burner replacement that has a bunch of brass nozzles or whatever they called....I don't know how it would work on standard home gas line but I know a guy uses it for his store to cook n boil and it is hotter than hell....Seems to be hotter than standard propane....

hmmm, well I was told you need all those nozzles to add heat or cooking times take forever.

I just cant see how you "fix" or attach the burner securely in place? I don't weld or know a welder.

I do see the burner rings with all the nozzles at the hardware stores and that's what got me wanting to do this but I want it safe, I don't want it to be a hack job.

[lil bubba]

If you want to only boil all you need is a pipe with cap and a hole drilled in cap.....Elbow the pipe out and go to home depot and get the size clear plastic line they sell and a hose clamp to clamp it to pipe and to existing gas line...Of course you need a gas valve at the end of your existing gas line to adjust pressure....If you want to cook you better off with a burner but if you put a flat plate under the pot on a pipe burner it works ok....You can swap out the burner with all the nozzles but I don't think a home line has enough volume....Maybe with propane....I personally used this at this store and it is hotter than propane but he also has a 1-1/2 to 2 inch gas line coming in , I don't remember....Nat. gas is cheaper than propane....We run 2 nat. gas burners inside and 2 propane outside for fishfrys and the propane use a tank each after 2 fry's while the nat. gas uses 15-20 dollars for 7 fry's.....

[keakar]

yep, its only for boiling crabs with, roughly 1/2 to a full bushel at a time.

I was just told by people (free advice is worth what you paid for it lol) but they said no way is one jet going to put out enough heat and it takes forever to cook because nat gas has no pressure behind in like propane does so "they" said I needed one of those rings with all the jets so it puts out enough heat to do the job. but there must be enough pressure for it coming into the house because the water heater and central heaters are putting out 150,000 BTUs on the house gas supply. I know stoves and gas valves on things regulate the pressure they let pass so I wasn't expecting to hear I might have a pressure supply issue with it.

this will need to be be running off of a 1/2 gas line from the back of the house. would drilling out the hole on my propane burner get me enough heat from that so my boiling and cooking times will be equal to propane or close to it? if so what size bit should I use?

[lil bubba]

Nat. gas is not hot as propane on a standard home gas line....Adding more openings only reduce flow pressure unless you have capacity...I used the one hole pipe cap on a 1 1/2 inch gas line and it worked just as good as propane....When the gas company swapped meters and went with standard gas line it worked ok for me but it will not equal the pressure of propane....I tried a cooking burner on nat. gas to boil and it sucked....It was actually a burner from a water heater....Cooked great....Took forever to boil....If you already have a pipe cap on your propane just get a cap and drill a bigger hole and you still have the one for propane if you not happy with it....Just reduce or upsize the pipe for the hose...

[biggun]

There is a guy here in LA.. That is at all the outdoor show's. He builds and sells an AWESOME N.G. SS boiling burner...

He is and was at the Sportsman show every yr.. But I can't remember his company or brand name.. I'd just google it..

His burners are the Stizzz. I google it for U.. IT's G4 burners. They be $300+. SS will last a life time. Look it up...


Gunner

[keakar]

Originally Posted by biggun

There is a guy here in LA.. That is at all the outdoor show's. He builds and sells an AWESOME N.G. SS boiling burner...

He is and was at the Sportsman show every yr.. But I can't remember his company or brand name.. I'd just google it..

His burners are the Stizzz. I google it for U.. IT's G4 burners. They be $300+. SS will last a life time. Look it up...


Gunner

yes, I think you are talking about g4 burners in Raceland and there are a couple others around in regular steel all right at $300 price but that's out of my price range even though they look nice. I would be looking for something complete that was in the $150 or less area which might be a little unrealistic for a custom made burner.

[keakar]

Originally Posted by lil bubba

Nat. gas is not hot as propane on a standard home gas line....Adding more openings only reduce flow pressure unless you have capacity...I used the one hole pipe cap on a 1 1/2 inch gas line and it worked just as good as propane....When the gas company swapped meters and went with standard gas line it worked ok for me but it will not equal the pressure of propane....I tried a cooking burner on nat. gas to boil and it sucked....It was actually a burner from a water heater....Cooked great....Took forever to boil....If you already have a pipe cap on your propane just get a cap and drill a bigger hole and you still have the one for propane if you not happy with it....Just reduce or upsize the pipe for the hose...

ok, I have the "jet burner" I assume since its the one with the one cap and one hole under a short pipe to direct/contain the flame.

so you say I just need to drill a new cap for nat gas use? that sounds easy enough to do but how do I figure out the drill bit size I need?

I can see where this step is easy to get wrong so is there a website place that tells me what size is best or at least a starting point?

[lil bubba]

Originally Posted by keakar

ok, I have the "jet burner" I assume since its the one with the one cap and one hole under a short pipe to direct/contain the flame.

so you say I just need to drill a new cap for nat gas use? that sounds easy enough to do but how do I figure out the drill bit size I need?

I can see where this step is easy to get wrong so is there a website place that tells me what size is best or at least a starting point?

Mine was 1/8....It just cost the price of a hose and 2 clamps and a couple fittings and new cap to see and if you think it can go bigger just drill 1/16 in. bigger but I think 1/8 should do....That guy in raceland may be where that store owner bought his and it is the fire of hell but like I said he is running a 1 1/2 to 2 inch line so it has a lot more volume...Can't say what it will do on a residentual line.....

[lil bubba]

This is what I'm speaking of and it claims residential gas is sufficiant ....Ace in laplace has them....

[keakar]

Originally Posted by lil bubba

This is what I'm speaking of and it claims residential gas is sufficiant ....

yes, that's what I had in mind

I have something like this now: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Bayou-Classic-Jet-Outdoor-Cooker-/141484926863?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20f128 a78f

and its all welded except for the single brass end cap on the 90 at the end of the pipe, and it has a flame tube instead of an enclosure for wind protection so I was thinking its not a practical donor to convert over to natural gas so ....

I was thinking I could buy one like this http://www.ebay.com/itm/Outdoor-Gas-Cooker-Propane-Stand-Burner-Camping-Turkey-Fry-Bbq-Jet-High-Pressure-/161628726760?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item25a1d2 a5e8

and switch the burners out with one like you pictured http://www.ebay.com/itm/Outdoor-Gas-Cooker-Propane-Stand-Burner-Camping-Turkey-Fry-Bbq-Jet-High-Pressure-/161628726760?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item25a1d2 a5e8


if I bought these two and put them together (and if it would work of course) I would be around $110 for it

I just don't know what is involved in switching those burners out, if I would need brackets welded on to support it or what and then the clearance questions, would the flame be too close to the pot or not close enough?.

[keakar]

I don't know what is going on but this website keeps replacing my links (6 times already after the link was posted and tested to be working and correct, I come back to find it is changed or not working) but here is the correct link for the burners I had in mind: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Jet-Burner-2...item338e9d4f70

I was also thinking about this one as a better option I can see might be easier to attach the other burners too since it has a flat plate under it http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sportsman-Se...3D161628726760

[Andy C]

Didn't look at them, if you can change just the orifices, ( cheep if they change able) ng is not as hot as propane hints the need for bigger orifices for the same heat-cook times. Tieing into (community ng) be careful! How you do it. Most gas co. Don't like that, and will pull your mater or lock your gas off!!

[keakar]

Originally Posted by Andy C

Didn't look at them, if you can change just the orifices, ( cheep if they change able) ng is not as hot as propane hints the need for bigger orifices for the same heat-cook times. Tieing into (community ng) be careful! How you do it. Most gas co. Don't like that, and will pull your mater or lock your gas off!!

no com gas taps here, its residential connection at the house after the meter tapped from a gas line in the house.

this link shows exactly what I have now (just stumbled across it): http://www.ebay.com/itm/12-Port-Outd...item5b0d0bbb75

which is a 3/8" steel pipe with a 90 screwed onto the end to direct gas upward with a brass acorn cap screwed on top of it with a hole drilled in it to be the one jet it has.

im thinking it wouldn't do much to just drill out that one hole when im trying to boil an 80 qt pot of water with it, or am I wrong?

[Andy C]

Got you, probably not changeable orifices. But maybe, what I was saying is if the gas company comes by for any reason and the "tie in" was not done by a "license plumber" it could be more trouble then it saves. Not saying never done it just telling you from experience.

[keakar]

Originally Posted by Andy C

Got you, probably not changeable orifices. But maybe, what I was saying is if the gas company comes by for any reason and the "tie in" was not done by a "license plumber" it could be more trouble then it saves. Not saying never done it just telling you from experience.

gotcha, yep I do things the right way according to building codes only.

the one jet I have can be drilled out but im not sure if doing it would give me the results im after with just one flame point under lower pressure but then I just don't know since I never tried this before.

maybe before buying the other stuff to put something together, I think i'll get another 3/8" brass acorn cap and drill it out to test how it boils the pot but the pipe on it is only 3/8" to start with and lil bubba was saying I should keep it to 1/2" so that's a question mark already.

[saute86]

Originally Posted by lil bubba

This is what I'm speaking of and it claims residential gas is sufficiant ....Ace in laplace has them....

We use those for woks on the buffet. I would go with this set up. They put out some serious heat and u can control a low flame and not have to put up with soot. You will have less cleaning on the out side of your pot.

[keakar]

Originally Posted by saute86

We use those for woks on the buffet. I would go with this set up. They put out some serious heat and u can control a low flame and not have to put up with soot. You will have less cleaning on the out side of your pot.

well what I was asking about is I was thinking I could get the propane cooker I linked to as a base for the frame and all that and that design has a bottom plate that I think might give me the easiest way to attach the ring jet thing after I take off the casted cooking burner to replace it with the ring jet that lil bubba was talking about. I just don't know if the wind guard ring is going to be big enough to fit the ng ring jet inside it.

the 23 jet ring burner is 9" wide OD so does anyone know if I need a full 1" clearance around it from any wind screen ring or would just 1/2" clearance be ok? because I don't know if this flame is going to spread outward or just straight up, if straight up the 1/2" should be ok but if it flares out I don't know by how much.

then im not sure if I even need or want a wind screen shield for it? do you really need one of all your doing is boiling?

[Riceland]

I've been looking at doing the same thing. Using or building a stand for the 23 jet burner. There are videos on youtube with NG setups people have put together using the same burners, mostly for home brewing setups. All have claimed some fairly quick boil times. There is another company besides G4 in La. who is making something for NG like I am looking to build.

http://www.bayouboiler.com/